Same sex marriages

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Curious Cat, Oct 25, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. minimalposter

    minimalposter some call me ... mp

    Messages:
    5,058
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    213
    As a single-divorced man, I think it is very hard to find a friend/relationship and I commend (and am jealous) of everyone who does so.

    It seems as though I end up with some long winded post in these "politically driven" off topic threads that few read and none reply to. So I will leave it at that ;)
     
  2. New Cell

    New Cell Unleashed Enigma

    Messages:
    3,627
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Thank you! I'm with you and several others who still believe in traditional values...:)
    Today, the new secular movement is stronger than ever and 'we' have become the apparent unjustifiable faith and that's sad. :(
    For I have no problem with those who are gay, atheist or whatever. Just never ask me to apologize for my belief in God and the bible...
    I know that's not in anyones mind for now, but it seems destined on the future horizon...
    I pray, I'm wrong...
     
  3. questionfear

    questionfear Google'd.

    Messages:
    5,156
    Likes Received:
    1,695
    Trophy Points:
    288
    I don't think anyone in this thread is telling you to renounce your beliefs. All that's being said is that belief systems vary from person to person. I respect and understand that as a person of jewish faith, I am a minority in religious viewpoints in America. I do not think that my government should be run with the express religious viewpoint of any one person.
    I also wish the internet were around when interracial marriage, slavery, women's rights to vote, etc were being debated. I wonder if similar threads would exist, stating that while interracial couples can be together, it's an offence against traditional values and does not belong in the definition of marriage? Or that women, while certainly able to join in the debate, should be sitting at home waiting for their husbands? If we let the world be run by what has been tradition, religious or cultural, we're ceding that the world should be run by old white christian men.

    And that's just wrong.

    Back to the immediate focus, I suggest everyone who is torn or believes strongly that gay marriage is wrong should go out and find a same-sex couple with kids. Talk to them, listen to their stories. Don't read something on a thread or in the paper. Put a face and names and the image of a loving family unit in your head. THEN tell me that God hates it and that we're all sinners.
     
  4. New Cell

    New Cell Unleashed Enigma

    Messages:
    3,627
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    198
    The point "I see", is where does this end, please tell me......
    Can my dog have marriage with my birds and recieve the benefits that heterosexuals have? Then what happens when compatibility is null and divorce takes place. Who get's the puppies, or the eggs 'unhatched'!!!!
    It just seems to open for 'me' and keep that in mind; an entire new world of problems...
    We have so many already, can we ever get back to simplicity, does this help or create further complex living???
     
  5. questionfear

    questionfear Google'd.

    Messages:
    5,156
    Likes Received:
    1,695
    Trophy Points:
    288
    Look, you are the one using the slippery slope argument here. Let's analyze the differences between same-sex marriage and all your issues with bestiality, etc:
    1) Same-sex couples, with the exception of gender, fall into all the same legal and ethical patterns that heterosexual couples do; they are consenting adults who care for one another, and they wish to build lives together around that. I think the key word here is CONSENTING adults. Animals cannot consent, they are not human, therefore they fall outside the realm of what would be acceptable on a basic ethical level. With that in mind, you also can rest assured no one is arguing for pedophilia, necrophilia, etc. Consent is consent in any relationship, and you need two adults who can make decisions for themselves in order to create it.
    2) I find it incredibly offensive and short sighted of you (and everyone else who makes that comparison) that homosexuality=beastiality. You have a real issue here that goes beyond same-sex marriage, New Cell; you are downright homophobic. It sounds to me like you don't even understand that the foundations of a same-sex union are love, respect, and understanding, just like in a heterosexual one. From everything you said, you seem to be arguing the reason for a ban on same-sex marriage is religious, but your arguments are tending towards substantive ones against homosexuality as a whole. I really think you need to realize that some people are born different than you. Do you hate people of african descent for not being white? Do you hate Jews and Muslims and Buddhists and Hindus for not being Christian? I truly believe that society will reach a point where homophobia is akin to racism, because much like race, people can't control being gay or straight. I knew when I was 15 that I was a lesbian. No one told me, no one hurt me or manipulated me. I looked around one day and slowly things started to click. Do you think that I wanted that, to be wandering my high school wishing I could find other gay kids? Do you think I wanted the long and difficult road my family and I have travelled to come to terms with this? Do you think I want to know that if I want kids with a partner, we have to jump through flaming hoops, while any schmuckwad guy and girl in vegas can get drunk and get married at any time of the day or night? I am incredibly happy with who I am now, more so than I ever was when I struggled with confusion over my sexuality. But your god says it's a sin. So clearly I should suffer, hide who I am, for YOUR beliefs.

    Doesn't it say in the bible somewhere to do unto others as you would want them to do unto you? Would you like me to waltz around discussing how your life is akin to beastiality and how sinful and how god would never bless your life?

    I know God loves me, and I know that God wants me to embrace who I am.

    As for getting back to simplicity, what's simplicity for you? Maybe I should go have a "Boston Marriage" where I live with a woman for 40 years but we're just two old spinsters. Or, even better, we can go back to a time where they'll stone gay people. That sure was a simpler time.

    I am strongly resisting the urge to take all these posts and plug in "interracial marriage" for "same sex", then you tell me how much better it was when only the white people could get married.

    Do you see my point yet?
     
  6. r0k

    r0k Dazed

    Messages:
    9,750
    Likes Received:
    1,264
    Trophy Points:
    288
    The issue of God's love is not negotiable. If anybody goes around claiming gays not loved by God, the person who says such a thing needs to repent right now.
     
  7. dogbarber

    dogbarber No one in particular...

    Messages:
    4,734
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    233
    Bar's Closed.....closing time. Good night all!.....................................
     
  8. Curious Cat

    Curious Cat Mobile Deity Super Moderator

    Messages:
    2,661
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    238
    In some ways I enjoy gays more then non gays. It's not that I'm gay or even that I have any tendencies that way. It's just that I look at it like when I'm going on a vacation. When I travel I want to meet locals and get to know them. I don't want to travel with a bunch of fellow Americans and talk about a lot of stuff that's familiar to me. I want to see how the French live and think, the Swedes, the Australians whatever. I'm more interested in where we are different then where we are alike. It's not what is better but just an amazement at the diversity of life and lifestyles. I want to know how a Hungarian out in a small town buys groceries, what kind of TV programs if any they watch and if they get on the internet. I find it interesting how interracial couples cope with prejudices and how gay couples look at things like who does what the husband traditionally does and who does what the wife traditional does. What do they think about raising a family? I just find it boring to stick with what's comfortable or usual and believe it or not, I look at religious people the same way. They have so many Do's and Don'ts that I never think about that I find that fascinating. I just love the diversity. I don't want to see a world where everyone is using just Palms or just PPC's or just buys PC's instead of Apples. Lets appreciate the differences in each other, not look for faults.
     
  9. New Cell

    New Cell Unleashed Enigma

    Messages:
    3,627
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    198
    I don't hate as you put it in your own words anyone. I only question same sex marriage. Who is consenting? O.K. forget animals like apes or monkeys that mimic us in all aspects and are considered by darwin our ancestors...
    So my flowers that I love can't wed me? Why not? they eat my food I give them love and attention and they wake up to the light I provide them. Are you avoiding their happiness and my love for them? why?

    You start something, be prepared for more. Just make sure you realize what doors you are opening and the doors you close....... Simple!...:)
     
  10. tanbam

    tanbam Mobile Deity

    Messages:
    476
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    78
    NC, I am having a hard time deciding whether or not you are really just kidding, or if you really feel that allowing gay marriage is just a step away from opening the door to allow you to marry your houseplants.

    I had to go and look it up to make sure, but miscegenation (interracial marrying) was illegal in almost every state in the US, Vermont excluded. It took a long time for all of those laws to be repealed, the last one was in 2000, when Alabama finally repealed it.

    In 1965, there was a trial in which the interracial couple were sentanced to jail, and the judge used God as the basis for for his decision.

    Most of the opponents of interracial marriage used the bible to try to justify their positions. While that interperation isn't mainstream anymore, one that still is mainstream is the one that says that God commands that Christians are not to marry Non-Christians. If you take additional liberties with that interperation, it could mean that people of different religions should not intermarry. Do you also support the position that a man and woman of different religious beliefs should not have an officialy recognized marriage?

    While the Supreme Court (yes, it really had to go that far) was debating the constitutionality of banning interracial marriage in 1967 with the case of Loving vs. Virginia, there were many people who held the view that allowing White women to marry Black men was just a step away from allowing their White daughters to marry gorillas. It's been almost 40 years since the Court ruled that interracial marriage bans are unconstitutional, and I haven't heard of any gorilla-human marriage happening in the meantime.

    You've made some good arguments regarding some other topics, but in this particular one, you're just wrong.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page