Palm Treo 800w Review

Discussion in 'Headline News' started by Adama D. Brown, Jul 14, 2008.

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  1. Adama D. Brown

    Adama D. Brown Brighthand Reviewer

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    <p>The Treo 800w is Palm's latest smartphone for&nbsp;business users, and its first with Wi-Fi and GPS.</p> <p>At launch it is available only from Sprint, and this is one of the first devices with support for EV-DO Rev. A, a faster version of&nbsp;this carrier's&nbsp;3G cellular-wireless data network.</p> <p>Sprint is charging $250 for the 800w, a lower cost than is usual for a Treo on launch day, even if a two-year contract is necessary to get that price.</p><p><span onclick="displayWindow('http://www.brighthand.com/picture.asp?f=8005','Picture',770,780,'');"><img width="180" src="http://www.brighthand.com/assets/8007.jpg" alt="Palm Treo 800w" height="300" style="float: right; margin: 3px 5px;" /></span></p> <p><strong>Inside this Review</strong></p> <ul>

    Design and Construction</li>

    Display</li>

    Performance, Software, and Operating System</li>

    Communication and Connectivity</li>

    GPS Positioning</li>

    Bugs and Issues</li>

    Battery Life</li>

    Conclusion</li>

    Specifications</li> </ul> <p><strong>A Caveat Before&nbsp;I Start</strong></p> <p>I want to offer a disclaimer at the top:&nbsp;I only received&nbsp;the review unit of the 800w on July 11, so this review is by necessity based on somewhat more short term testing than I normally prefer.</p> <p>Under more relaxed circumstances, I prefer to get the feel of the device in use for a week or two before delivering my analysis. Of course, even given only about 60 hours I can do a lot of damage, and I've done my best to make the most of the time I have.</p> <p><strong><a name="Design"></a>Design and Construction</strong></p> <p>The 800w clearly borrows somewhat from the visual design of the Centro (which in turn borrowed from the Treo and other Palm units). It's got the same basic QWERTY-bar shape that the Treo line has always had, but dumps the old style buttons and directional pad for the newer Centro-style ones.</p> <p>All the application buttons feel pretty good, and the only placement I had trouble with was of the two soft-keys. Right up on the bottom part of the screen's bezel, they're easily missed, particularly in a dark environment: unlike all the other buttons, they have no backlighting.</p> <p><span onclick="displayWindow('http://www.brighthand.com/picture.asp?f=8016','Picture',770,666,'');"><img width="300" src="http://www.brighthand.com/assets/8018.jpg" alt="Palm Treo 800w" height="250" style="float: right; margin: 3px 5px;" /></span></p> <p>The keyboard is acceptable, though it has very little key travel, meaning you don't get that perceptible "deep click" that makes it easy to know when you've actually pushed the button. It seems fairly reliable, so you may get used to it in time, but at first it's definitely disconcerting. It seems that there's less key travel in the center of the keyboard than at the corners.</p> <p>Also, the keyboard lacks an button assigned to the colon: you need to use the on-screen symbol selector if you want to insert one in your text.</p> <p>I'm not wild about the 800w's thickness, to be honest. At a hair under three quarters of an inch, it's 50% thicker than, say, the Samsung i780 which has nearly the same feature set. And that extra size isn't being put into the battery: the 800w has the same 1150 mAh cell that was barely adequate on the Centro, a smaller device that didn't have Wi-Fi or GPS.</p> <p>For perspective, the 800w is almost exactly as thick as the HTC Mogul, a device which features a sliding keyboard and 1500 mAh battery, along with nearly the same feature set as the Treo. For all the work that must have gone into this design, and the fact that it's Palm's flagship model going forward, I'm surprised they couldn't slim down the design a little more. Even just another tenth of an inch would make a big difference in how the device feels.</p> <p>The overall build quality of the 800w is pretty good: the only spot where it actually feels flimsy is the thin plastic stylus, which I could break with three fingers. Not being an integral component, though, I wouldn't worry too much about it. Otherwise the device is well built, and feels solid.</p> <p><strong><a name="Display"></a>Display</strong></p> <p>The 320-by-320-pixel screen is far and away an improvement on the old 240-by-240-pixel one&nbsp;of the 700w and 750 models, though it's surprisingly dim. I had to crank the backlight all the way up to maximum to get an acceptable brightness. This may have been a deliberate measure on Palm's part to save battery life: see below.</p> <p><span onclick="displayWindow('http://www.brighthand.com/picture.asp?f=8019','Picture',770,600,'');"><img width="200" src="http://www.brighthand.com/assets/8021.jpg" alt="Palm Treo 800w" height="243" style="float: left; margin: 3px 7px;" /></span></p> <p>It's quite a bit sharper than the displays on those&nbsp;earlier Treos, though, having almost twice as many pixels, and&nbsp;that makes a big difference when you're looking at text.</p> <p>The display itself has a bit of a blueish cast, both in its whites and in its colors. It's most noticeable looking at pale reds, which can take on a purplish look.</p> <p><strong><a name="Performance"></a>Performance, Software, and Operating System</strong>

    The Treo 800w runs Windows Mobile 6.1, the latest version of the platform, but users of touchscreen-based devices are unlikely to be wowed by the differences from Windows Mobile 6. The update that was so major for non-touchscreen models is very "ho hum" here, adding only threaded SMS and other almost inconsequential changes.</p> <p>As with previous WM Treos, Palm's added a few tweaks to the device, mostly in the form of shortcut keys and a Today screen custom plug-in. Not bad, but a lot less impressive now with manufacturer customizations like TouchFLO on the market than it was when the first Windows Mobile Treos came out -- and it wasn't all that Earth-shattering then.</p> <p>Palm doesn't actually admit what speed the processor is running in any of their documentation, so we can't be certain. However, leaked data suggests that it's clocked at 333 MHz, and my benchmark testing confirms that it's somewhere close to this number.</p> <p>Performance is acceptable most of the time, though given the fact that this is supposed to be a high-end device I'd have loved to see a little more kick put into it. Particularly since Internet Explorer Mobile, pig that it is, bogs down the device terribly when trying to load any sizable page.</p> <p>Palm's marketing material makes a big deal out of the Treo 800w not needing "third party" servers to get email from a company's Exchange system -- and of course, by "third party"&nbsp;it means "Research In Motion."&nbsp;Palm is&nbsp;clearly trying to sell the Treos as an alternative to BlackBerry devices, and leaning on the Direct Push feature of Windows Mobile to do it.</p> <p><strong><a name="Connectivity"></a>Communication and Connectivity</strong></p> <p>The 800w is the first of the Treos -- or any smartphone from Palm -- to feature internal Wi-Fi, making it a big deal, even though other smartphones have had this going back many years.</p> <p>On the top of the unit is placed a simple single-button control for the Wi-Fi radio: press to activate. It may sound a little too idiot-proof, but it really is fairly easy to deal with, and I found the Wi-Fi performance to be sound. The network search system is the standard Windows Mobile Wi-Fi manager, so you don't need to mess around with any other software. Speed was certainly more than enough to max out my DSL connection, and I had no problems with signal strength, though admittedly my house is pretty well drenched in Wi-Fi.</p> <p>The rest of the communications package&nbsp;includes dual-band CDMA and EV-DO Revision A. Rev. A makes its first appearance on a Palm unit, bringing with it increased upload speeds. Despite the length of time that Rev. A has been in use by Sprint and Verizon, there's actually only a handful of smartphones that are enabled for it, of which the Treo is one.</p> <p> <table border="0" align="right" cellpadding="2"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <script src="http://www.Brighthand.com/assets/1628.js"></script> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> The 800w also marks another first, Palm's use of the new "micro-USB" port in place of the older and more established mini-USB. I can't help but wonder at the reasoning behind this. It's one of three things. Option A, the nicest one, is that using micro-USB actually allowed them to save some room which was needed for other components. Given the amount of wasted space in the device, I doubt it. Option B is that they simply expect this to become the new standard. Option C, the least flattering, is that they want you to have to rebuy all your accessories, and hopefully do so from Palm.</p> <p>Whatever it is, the micro-USB connector is not a good trend. It's stiffer than a mini-USB port, so tight that you really have to put some energy into the cable to get it out. I've seen cases like this before, and typically connectors this tight tend to break much sooner and much easier than ones where you don't have to constantly twist and yank. I also don't get how this saves space, since it's almost the same size as a mini-USB port.</p> <p>Also, as is too typical, the micro-USB port also serves as an audio output. In a nice twist though, the box does contain a basic stereo headset: nothing special, but serviceable both as a handsfree device and for sound. Many manufacturers don't bother to include one these days, even when they're using a proprietary port for audio. Kudos.</p> <p>I should also mention that the 800w has Bluetooth 2.0, allowing you to use wireless accessories like the headsets that are rapidly becoming ubiquitous.</p> <p><strong><a name="GPS"></a>GPS Positioning</strong></p> <p>Yet another first for Palm comes in the form of integrated GPS. The device comes loaded with Sprint-branded navigation and local search applications as well as Windows Live with GPS support.</p> <p>For navigation, of course, Sprint wants to obligate you to use its own branded service, which is basically a form of the widely available TeleNav over-the-air map system. To this end, there's no other GPS mapping or nav-capable software packaged with the device. Fortunately, unlike other providers who bill separately for TeleNav, Sprint offers it as part of a bundle with any Power Vision data plan costing $20 per month or higher. Plus, you have the option to use navigation software from other companies.</p> <p>Getting the GPS itself running offered a bit of a fight. Since the Treo 800w uses a Qualcomm chipset for it's CDMA/EV-DO radio, I assume that it's using the built-in GPS support on that board, the way most of HTC's GPS-enabled models do. And while these devices do prefer to use the cell network to boost their lock-on speed, it's not absolutely necessary -- I've watched the Sprint Mogul get a lock with its cellular radio turned off entirely. However, the 800w seemed obsessed with dialing out whenever I tried to startup the GPS. With the cellular radio turned off, it wouldn't even try to search for satellites.</p> <p><span onclick="displayWindow('http://www.brighthand.com/picture.asp?f=8022','Picture',770,780,'');"><img width="250" src="http://www.brighthand.com/assets/8024.jpg" alt="Palm Treo 800w" height="310" style="float: right; margin: 3px 5px;" /></span></p> <p>At first, I thought this was simply some kind of bug, with the device automatically wanting to get GPS assistance information, and then stalling when it couldn't. However, the error message for the Sprint Maps application made it rather more clear: in order to use the GPS, you must be connected to the cellular network. It won't even let you use Wi-Fi as a substitute. I guessed that this was simply a restriction on the Sprint apps, but I'm afraid it goes further -- even third-party applications like Efficasoft GPS Utilities can't get the GPS receiver to respond without letting it talk to the network.&nbsp;</p> <p>In short, it appears that whether by design or accident, the Treo 800w's internal GPS receiver is somewhat crippled and tied inextricably to the Sprint network.</p> <p>To be fair, when it is allowed to contact the network, getting a lock is fast and easy, often in a matter of seconds. But I can't condone this blurring of lines between standalone GPS -- which the Palm documentation describes the Treo 800w as having, in no uncertain terms -- and cellular location-based services. Either this setup is broken and needs to be fixed in the first ROM update, or someone's engaged in deceptive advertising.</p> <p><strong><a name="Bugs"></a>Bugs and Issues</strong></p> <p>I have to note that I experienced some highly erratic behavior from the device after draining the battery. Even after being plugged into the AC adapter, the phone wouldn't come back on, and the charging light would flick on and off randomly. Finally after fiddling with it, it started up again upon reinserting the charger plug yet again. I have no way of explaining what was wrong, and it might not ever happen to someone who doesn't fully drain the battery. However, it could also represent a</p> <p>Also under the "bugs and oddities" file, Google Maps does not work on the 800w. Period. It won't work over Wi-Fi, and it won't work over cellular: it simply acts as if there's no Internet connection present.</p> <p><em>UPDATE:</em> Google Maps has begun working on the 800w now, leading me to assume that the problem was some kind of temporary glitch with the service.</p> <p><strong><a name="Battery"></a>Battery Life</strong></p> <p>Now here's the onion.</p> <p>I'm not at all happy with the Treo's battery life. It's just barely adequate for use as a phone -- add Direct Push, or a little Wi-Fi use, and you're sucking down battery power like it's icewater in the Gobi Desert.</p> <p>Heavy users had best plan to either leave chargers lying around wherever they go, or buy a larger extended battery. (And deal with the increased bulk and thickness that brings with it.)</p> <p><span onclick="displayWindow('http://www.brighthand.com/picture.asp?f=8013','Picture',770,748,'');"><img width="230" src="http://www.brighthand.com/assets/8015.jpg" alt="Palm Treo 800w" height="284" style="float: right; margin: 3px 5px;" /></span> I can't fathom Palm's thinking in using such a tiny battery for such a feature rich and hungry device. It certainly doesn't recommend the 800w as a Blackberry replacement when I doubt you'd get 24 hours of standby out of the device with Direct Push enabled.</p> <p><strong><a name="Specifications"></a>Specifications</strong></p> <p>Processor: 333 MHz OMAP2430<br />Operating System: Windows Mobile 6.1 Professional (Pocket PC)<br />Display 2.4 inch, 320&nbsp;by 320 pixel&nbsp;touchscreen LCD<br />Memory: 128 MB of RAM; 256 MB of Flash&nbsp;ROM&nbsp;(160 MB available)<br />Size and Weight: 4.4 inches long&nbsp;by 2.3 inches wide&nbsp;by 0.73 inches thick; 5 ounces<br />Expansion: Single microSDHC slot<br />Docking: Micro-USB connector<br />Communication: Dual-band CDMA/EV-DO Revision A; 802.11b/g WiFi; Bluetooth 2.0/EDR<br />Audio: Earpiece and microphone; rear speaker; headphone/audio out via micro-USB port<br />Battery: 1150 mAh replaceable Lithium Ion<br />Input: Touchscreen; 5-way directional pad; 20-button predictive keyboard/keypad<br />Other: 2.0 megapixel camera; internal GPS receiver</p><p><strong> <p><a name="Conclusion"></a>Conclusion</p> </strong></p> <p>The 800w finally brings the Treo line into feature parity with other contemporary smartphones for the first time. Whether that, combined with the Palm brand, is enough to draw in users despite some of the drawbacks is another question.</p> <p>My own feeling is that while the 800w isn't necessarily a bad unit, the fact is that Palm's just now packing in features that other manufacturers have already done, and better. Palm needed a knockout device, and while the 800w may fulfill the niche for the retiring 700w, it's not very likely to bring people breaking Palm's doors down.</p> <p>Pros:</p> <ul>

    Wi-Fi with hardware button</li>

    Internal GPS</li>

    Reasonable price with new contract</li> </ul> <p>Cons:</p> <ul>

    Inadequate battery life</li>

    Thick</li>

    Micro-USB connector</li>

    GPS cannot be used without cellular connection</li> </ul> <p>Bottom Line:</p> <blockquote> <p>Palm has significantly improved its Windows-based Treo line, but a small battery and poor GPS implementation keep it from achieving its full potential.</p> </blockquote> <p>The&nbsp;Treo&nbsp;800w is available now on <a target="_blank" href="http://www.brighthand.com/scripts/redirect.asp?merchantPricingID=776409&amp;merchantID=276386&amp;productID=1628">Sprint's web site</a>.&nbsp;</p>
     
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  2. mkheraj

    mkheraj Newbie

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    Excellent review, Adama, even with the shortened timeframe. I was actually looking forward to this device from Palm and I am thoroughly disappointed. I had battery drain issues with my Treo 750 and if your review is any indication, it's going to be worse on the Treo 800. I guess I'll have to take another look at the HP Ipaq 910 or the Nokia e71.

    Murad
     
  3. GF

    GF Mobile Evangelist

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    "Also, the keyboard lacks an button assigned to the colon: you need to use the on-screen symbol selector if you want to insert one in your text."

    I don't have the Treo 800w. I think all Treo device can use the ALT button to insert symbols.
     
  4. reidme

    reidme Mobile Enthusiast

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    It's disappointing that the GPS won't work without a cell connection, but it probably gets the maps over the network anyway, so the GPS could only give you numerical coordinates. Garmin GPS devices store maps for all of NA in less than 2GB though, so it would certainly be possible to keep the maps on the micro-sdhc card.
     
  5. holvoetn

    holvoetn Still a moderator ...

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    Somehow I just got a thought to go buy a new battery for my 680 after all ...
    Or will difference with the rumored 850W be sufficient to make it worthwile to hold just a little more ? (as far as I remember it is a GSM version of 800w)
     
  6. Adama D. Brown

    Adama D. Brown Brighthand Reviewer

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    Thank you, glad you liked it.

    Yes, you can--you just shouldn't have to. A colon should have higher priority when you're laying out the keyboard than the semicolon.

    It does get the maps over the air, but half the point is that even with third-party apps, it STILL won't let you get a GPS position without the network.

    Hard to say: the 850w could turn out to be basically the same, or it could be significantly improved and better tweaked. We won't really know until we see it. I'm not terribly optimistic based on the 800w, though. None of it's fatal, but with all the time they've had and everything that's riding on their flagship model, they should have done a better job.

    If I were where you are, though, I'd look at the Samsung i780. It's thinner, sexier, and has basically the same features.
     
  7. wesley762

    wesley762 Mobile Evangelist

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    I put my hands on one of these today and I was very impressed till I pulled out the stylus. it felt like a wet noodle. it bent almost in half when I had a good grasp on it. I was almost convenced to get one right there and then, but after holding the stylus I am just not so sure now. that is one of the things that I have loved about my 700 is the metal stylus. just a heads up out there.
     
  8. Adama D. Brown

    Adama D. Brown Brighthand Reviewer

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    Personally I wouldn't base a buying decision on the stylus, since it's something that's so easily replaced by a third-party option. The stock stylus is disappointing, but the size and length isn't bad, so a metallic replacement would be nicely proportioned.
     
  9. wesley762

    wesley762 Mobile Evangelist

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    it hasn't totally put it out for me, I just want to see a replacement or 3rd party stylus before I invest in a new phone. I am not one to carry a pen around so it would have to be something that fit in the factory slot, otherwise I would never have a stylus.
     
  10. Fixup

    Fixup Smartphone Enthusiast

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    What a total failure! I see Palm dying in near future. Battery life sucks to hell, a-GPS only, $600 tag, micro USB, ... who's stupid enough to buy this thing?

    How about one-hand operation?
     
  11. Antoine Wright

    Antoine Wright Neighborhood Mobilist Super Moderator

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    Sheesh Adama; me thinks you like smartphones now :p j/k

    Interesting, your review is less flowerly than others that I've read. And usually that's a solid sign that not everything is perfect. I would have had a different opinion if it were in my hands ;) but then again, you like WM more than I too :D

    Weird that the network issues have caused a good deal of issues. What's Sprint normally like up that ways for you?
     
  12. adamz

    adamz Mobile Enthusiast

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    I saw that happen when I was indoors, but standing near the window or going outside it works perfectly on mine.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Adama D. Brown

    Adama D. Brown Brighthand Reviewer

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    To be fair, the hardware seems to be there for standalone GPS--it's a software limitation that it wants the cellular connection. Also, it's quite reasonably priced with a new contract.

    That said, it wouldn't be my first choice for a new smartphone, no.

    Typical for Windows Mobile Pro, which is to say pretty good. Very few operations actually need touchscreen input, even though having been so used to my Blackjack I kept looking for the "Back" button. :D

    I have to go a bit out of my way to hit real Sprint coverage, but we have full roaming including data on Verizon, so it wasn't much of a problem.

    I don't think it was really network issues so much as the configuration of the device. It's intended to be very network dependent--presumably for the purpose of tying the user to Sprint's services.

    That's bizarre. Besides the fact that I was sitting right next to a window 90% of the time I was trying to get it to work, where I was should have absolutely no relevance when I was trying to load over WiFi.

    Were you using the newest version of Google Maps straight off the site?
     
  14. loriot

    loriot Newbie

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    Thanks Adama for the excellent review ...

    ... which also makes me a bit sad. People said it so often and it was sometimes difficult to believe that the pioneer of PDAs went down the river. But actually it seems to happen just right now. Palm seems to be lost more than ever. I am sure they have given their best to make a new Palm flagship and now we can see it: It is all the best from Palm in 2008 and Adama did describe it very politely.
    If i compare it to any other Windows Mobile device on the market it is far behind the competition: WLAN, GPS, 2MPix cam, size, processor, UI..... They are all only standard or below. So what should be the key differentior to make people buy the Treo? OK, the design is nice but besides that? Now Palm is just one Phone out of hundred (?) others Windows Mobile phones and they are behind HTC, Samsumg, Nokia (OK, it is Symbian) and all the others. The only reason to buy it might be: you are some long time Palm friends, but will they love it? There is no Palm OS onboard anymore! My guess is that the hardcore Palm OS fans are since long time with the iPhone.
    Indeed I think that such Treo 800 HW with Palm OS would sell much better, but it would be still a disappointment.

    I am really Sorry but i think there is not much we can expect now from Palm, at least no good news.
     
  15. adamz

    adamz Mobile Enthusiast

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    Yes, when some one asked about it on Pocketnow, I downloaded version 2.1.0.10 straight from Google.com/gmm. I did see your issue the first time I ran it at the office, which was indoors, but when I got to the car I tried it again and the GPS worked right away in Google Maps. The "My Location" feature doesn't seem to work, but with such fast real GPS fix times, who cares?

    Bizarre indeed.
     
  16. Doyle

    Doyle Newbie

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    To me it looks like you are getting aGPS there, specifically a type of MS assist. I will bet if you take your 800w traveling outside of the US to Europe or Asia, a likely choice since it will function as a PDA with WiFi, you will get no GPS function. This is a serious deficiency on such an expensive "smart"phone.
     
  17. Matt J

    Matt J Mobile Deity

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    While it does seem like the 800w is a disappointment, I think there is some (not much) hope for the future. Because of Palm's lack of creativity, the next Treo/Centro running Palm OS II might actually be simple and user-friendly enough to capture some market share. I have been running Palm OS Garnet for years now, and it does the job quite well. Sometimes, ease of use is enough, hence why I never liked WM.
     
  18. Bob

    Bob Mobile Evangelist

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    Trying to remember the last time I used my mobile without a connection. Probably on a plane last year. I could use GPS for years and not see that the GPS needs a connection. Its a nonissue.
     
  19. adamz

    adamz Mobile Enthusiast

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    That's true, but if you're a Sprint customer, (and you need to be for the 800w) then your phone service isn't going to work in Europe and Asia anyway, so I can't imagine a world traveler would even consider buying this phone.
     
  20. r0k

    r0k Dazed

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    Ok, I'm asking this mainly as a formality as I'm pretty sure the answer is "no".

    Many moons ago, a Sprint rep told me the 800 would be able to run both Windows Mobile apps and PalmOS apps. Yep. He sure did. So, is Styletap included by default?

    r0k looks forward to being able to finally put this particular urban legend to rest...
     
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